outbreak

[Damian]

Hello, I just had my first outbreak in my aquarium and it was terrible. I have a 135 uniquarium tank with two heaters..temp kept at 80 F, plenty of oxygen, salinity level was always kept between 1.021- 1.023.... I have some live rock in there and had 11 fish now I only have 3....and barely surviving... the ones that died were: 3 bangaii cardinalfish, 1 yellow tang, 1 blue tang (she was the one that started everything, and the first one to die), 2 damselfish, 1 false percula clownfish. The ones that are still alive are 1 damsel, 1 clownfish, and a royal gramma, the royal gramma is in the worst conditions. All signs indicate that the parasite is Amyloodinium (oodinium)...at first I saw the blue tang with few white spots...she was scratching herself with the live rock. the next day I bought a quarantine tank and Nox-Ich...(treatment for marine ich) I put her in there but she died the next morning. A few days passed, and almost all fish showed signs of ich, the worst was the royal gramma. The yellow tang had no white spots neither did 1 of the clown, i put them all in the quarantine tank so they could all be under treatment. Next day, they all died except for the ones mentioned above. some things mentioned by the guy at the store were that high levels of salt may have caused ich or low levels of temp. Either it was the salinity, or they blue tang infected everyone because temp was always stable at 80 F. Now the royal gramma is in the quarantine tank by herself, at the bottom and she is breathing heavily, i got this new medication called greenex,,,supposedly better than the one i had before, I raised the temp because i read that raising it might kill the parasites. The weird thing is that the gramma has no more white spots, now she has like a swollen face, has white in her eyes and she looks a bit fatter. I took her out of the quarantine tank and put her in freshwater for 3 min so that some of the parasites would come off(according to the guy in the store) then i returned her to the quarantine tank. I treated the big aquarium, I made a partial water change of about 30% of the water, dechlorinated it, took the carbon out and added 135 drops of greenex. then i let it rest for a bit. I did the same with the damsel and the clownfish (put them in freshwater), but i returned them to the big aquarium because they look healthier. Things are at that now, any suggestions comments or anything will be greatly apprecitated

[Paidbychrist0825]

it cannot be the salinity, because yours could actually come up a bit. Many aquariasts keep salinity at 1.025. the temp is ok, and the only thing that could have caused this is the blue tang, who, to my recollection, do not ship well. Ive never heard of the fresh water dip before, so i guess i learned something too:) and also, watch out for medicines, they may kill back some of your LR bacteria and life.
umm, ya that about covers it.

[Alf]

that high levels of salt may have caused ich

Find you a new LFS. This is Bull!!;) While I agree that most FO keepers keep lower SG, this is not the rule. A FO tank could actually be run any where from 1.017 up to 1.026. But if you keep LR I suggest the SG be to the higher end for good coraline alge growth. But hey thats just me.

low levels of temp
Also BS!!

OK #1 way to solve this problem with new arrivels[and this is most likely where the Ich came from was the new fish was stressed a brought it into the tank} Is to Q-tine all new fish for a min of two weeks, and treat while in there if needed.

Ok now to clarifiy above statements.
Low salinity say like 1.006 to 1.010 will help rid parisites like this but is stressful on fish. This is what we call Hyposalinity and is very efective in the q-tine tank.
High temps will not kill the parasite but it will actually speed up the process of matureing the parasite to eliminate them faster.
So in my Q-tine tank I run 82 to 84 degress and a salinity of 1.017 and if the fish shows signs of Ich I then lower it to 1.010 very slowly over a couple of days. Just what I do!!

Also the FW dip is a commin practice. but I do not subscrib to it as it will just add to the Fish's stress. But we use this practice in the wholesale side of things and some LFS as well are reporting good things from FW dips after new arrivels to thier stores. HTH

[crlkeep]

Yep, Robert pretty much said it all.

I am sometimes ashamed to call myself a LFS guy, but I do my best to talk about the things I know about, and leave the rest to those who know better than I. I am sorry your LFS guys was not even on the same page with the rest of the world, but not everyone has a problem selling you something that they don't even know how to care for.

Robert posted a thread for beginners and newbies to the Saltwater world. Here it is, check it out. It has a lot of great info...... New to reef tanks, check this out! (http://www.aquariumpros.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=526)

[Damian]

thanks for all the info.....i guess all this is just part of the hobby......i will now place all new fish in a 10 gal tank before putting them in the main tank.....i have a few questions about this though....for how long should i keep them there before placing them in the main tank?....should any medication be given to them just in case they have ick or any other parasites??....isnt the tank too small for marine fish to be there for more than a week?...should i put sand in it and live rock so they can feel comfortable??...... i also have a few questions about my main tank....is the water in my main tank bad because of the ick that was there or is still there??....should i keep treating the main tank?......sorry about all the questions its just that i do not want this to happen to me anymore (hopefully it wont)...thanks

[Damian]

two more questions.....for a marine fish tank and futures reef....what should i consider the salinity to be at??....and temp??..i was thinking keeping it a 80 is good...but i would like to know what you guys think...thanks :) :FS

[Alf]

for how long should i keep them there before placing them in the main

I Q-tine a min two weeks

should any medication be given to them just in case they have ick or any other parasites?

I only medicate if I see a reason to.

isnt the tank too small for marine fish to be there for more than a week?...
For larger fish this maybe true. I myself have a 55 gal so I never have this problem. A 20 gal might serve you better will hold larger fish.
should i put sand in it and live rock so they can feel comfortable??

I do not. I use fake decorations and pvc pipe and macro algeas to give the fish a place to hide.

is the water in my main tank bad because of the ick that was there or is still there??....
should i keep treating the main tank

I never treat my main tank. The parasite is always there it only arrives or is visible to us when the conditions are just right for them to thrive. Feed your fish well keep all parameters stable and the fish will fight off these things with there own Immune system.


what should i consider the salinity to be at??....and temp??
IN the main Tank
SG I run a 1.025 in all my reef tanks and my FO. Also I stage my temp with the seasons. 82-84 in summer and 80-82 in winter. this has help in achiving natural spawning in my tank every season.

Q-tine tanks are ran a little diffrent then your main tank. I use no filtartion and 10% water changes as needed to keep levels at normal. Q-tine tanks a little work while they are inhabited but it's worth it in the long run.HTH

[andrew79]

i agree with robert but i would qt any new fish for at least 3 weeks. the best ivestment you could get is a qt tank. if one of your fish has ich the probibility of all your fish having it is very high, you need to take all your fish out of your diplay and treat them with hypo. if you do this in your main tank you will kill your liverock and sand also any inverts. ick is a fish only disease and if you take out the fish the parasite will not have a host and they will die, the life cycle is about 3 weeks. also quick fixes like ick meds do not work well at all. the main way to kill this parasite is hypo

[crlkeep]

Hypo salinity is a somewhat effective treatment for marine fish, but it has its prolonged effects on them as well. Marine fish drink the saltwater, then seperate the salt from it and use the water in their bodies. If the salinity is kept to low for to long, the fish may start to succomb to osmotic shock, then all treatment is useless.

Best way to prevent disease outbreak in a marine tank is not to introduce a sick fish, by using a QT tank. You mentioned that there is plenty of oxygen in the water, how do you keep the oxygen levels up. Do you run a skimmer?

They sudden collapse of marine tanks is often due to an accumulation of organics in the water that are not being effectively removed. The advent of the skimmer helped to cure this problem to some degree, by removing DOC's and adding higher levels of oxygen. Some people run skimmerless systems, but most of them that are successful, are also experienced in the hobby.

[Damian]

is hypo having your salinity low??...like at 1.016-17??....is that the best way to cure ich??....how about malichite green with revive...does that work?